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Still learning - Tempo Mapping re-edits later...best practices?


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#1 cleverest

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 03:33 PM

I see some songs stating "fixed tempo mapping" or "improved tempo mapping with edits"

Being new to this and having issues, what are some best practices when going back to an earlier track and "improving" the tempo map? I noticed when doing this, and going back markers in time, it tends to mess up some later markers and becomes a big mess..it's probably a thing that comes from experience, but any tips anyone has besides "watch this video" (which I've done, as many as I could find), but I'm more curious about coming back to improve old songs as I get better at it with later ones...

Thanks.



#2 Shroud

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 04:34 PM

The best by far is not to rush it, and get it right the first time!

#3 cleverest

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 05:01 PM

The best by far is not to rush it, and get it right the first time!

I agree, just hoping for some tips as I've made a couple tracks, getting better, and don't want to start them over completely...



#4 onyxite

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 06:39 PM

Here is a technique I have used many times for doing "tempo map surgery" when there's a specific part that needs to be adjusted, without messing up what comes after:

  • Pick two points in time, one before and one after the part where you want to edit, that you know are already lined up correctly.
  • Make sure there is a tempo setting event at the second point; insert a (redundant) one if there isn't one already.
  • Write down the real time (minutes, seconds, milliseconds) and musical time (measures, beats, subbeats) of the second point.
  • Now you can start editing tempo events starting from the first point, making things line up better. When you reach the second point, set the tempo event that comes immediately before it such that its real time position matches what you wrote down before, down to the millisecond. This will probably require some trial and error with adjusting the BPM.

This process does not account for more complicated scenarios, like needing to remove or add time, or futzing with time signatures -- both of those usually involve more headaches, and you might be better off redoing the tempo map and copying tracks over as needed in that case.



#5 jerrylive365

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 08:10 PM

When it comes to a point where you have to edit a tempo map, unless its 1 or 2 measures, personally I would re-do the entire thing. Chances are you'll find that you had other slight mistakes that need some work, so by creating a new tempo map you'll most likely correct stuff you may have otherwise missed. 



#6 cleverest

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 09:26 PM

Thanks for the tips! Onyxite, that sounds like a good idea when things get desperate and judging from my experience so far that may be often for awhile...lol



#7 doa

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Posted July 13, 2020 - 11:50 PM

I would advise you to check out DNPGs thread on Advanced Tempo Mapping here:http://customscreato...y-to-tempo-map/

 

Also rubydanger's related video here: http://customscreato...ow-i-tempo-map/

 

In essence you create a macro and then place markers with the M key. With the macro you can easily tempo map between any two points. 



#8 cleverest

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Posted July 14, 2020 - 12:41 AM

I would advise you to check out DNPGs thread on Advanced Tempo Mapping here:http://customscreato...y-to-tempo-map/

 

Also rubydanger's related video here: http://customscreato...ow-i-tempo-map/

 

In essence you create a macro and then place markers with the M key. With the macro you can easily tempo map between any two points. 

I have watched the second video and set up my Reaper to do that...I've done it with one song, and was super happy with it, unless I went back and played it with a metronome...95% was great, but the 5% that wasn't, minor tweaks and it knocked a lot of out it out again...I need to learn what to do and not to do when fixing markers and such....but I think I'm close....

Thanks.



#9 rubydanger

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Posted July 14, 2020 - 04:58 AM

"Fixing" tempo map mistakes is tougher than actually doing a tempo map from scratch at times.  I do like jerry and basically redo everything after the mistake just to be safe, as I have told you, tempo map is basically the most important piece of a custom IMO


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Video on how I tempo map

Beginners Vocal charting video


#10 cleverest

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Posted July 14, 2020 - 04:29 PM

"Fixing" tempo map mistakes is tougher than actually doing a tempo map from scratch at times.  I do like jerry and basically redo everything after the mistake just to be safe, as I have told you, tempo map is basically the most important piece of a custom IMO

I will have to take extra time with it and make sure it's perfect before I move forward. Thanks.






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