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Is it possible for a HARM1 note to span multiple phrases?


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#1 Frick

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 04:29 PM

HARMs 2 and 3 can effortlessly have notes that span multiple phrases. I swear I've seen the same thing with HARM1 notes (although I can't name any examples so maybe I'm crazy), but trying to do so seems to raise the following error:

ERROR: MIDI Compiler: (HARM1): Vocal note at [M:B:T] extends beyond phrase

Obviously that makes sense as an error for solo vocals, but it seems odd to me that HARM1 would be specifically excluded in harmonies. Especially because this restriction is making for some very awkward phrases in a song I'm working on right now.



#2 Farottone

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 05:27 PM

IIRC only H2 and H3 can span phrases, which is ugly so it should be done sparingly anyway. Only thing I'd check is that you're not having slides that span phrases (which is a no-no for sure).



#3 Emotional Flight

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 05:36 PM

If you absolutely must have a Harm 1 note that spans over a new phrase, one "cheat" is to pull the note back to the phrase marker and put a new note directly after in it with a space as the lyric. Because the two notes connect over the phrase line and the lyric is invisible, it looks like one note.



#4 atupomaruru

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 08:00 PM

If you absolutely must have a Harm 1 note that spans over a new phrase, one "cheat" is to pull the note back to the phrase marker and put a new note directly after in it with a space as the lyric. Because the two notes connect over the phrase line and the lyric is invisible, it looks like one note.

 

This can also be done with "+" as the lyric for the second note, which works better with scrolling lyrics.



#5 Frick

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 08:17 PM

 

This can also be done with "+" as the lyric for the second note, which works better with scrolling lyrics.

Does that not violate the strict "no slides" rule? And I also assume it wouldn't apply to an unpitched syllable, which is the case for me.



#6 atupomaruru

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 08:21 PM

I think what farottone meant was that Magma won't complain about slides spanning phrases, but it looks just as ugly as if a single note was crossing the line, so be careful about that. Since a zero-tick slide between two notes of the same pitch is functionally and visually the same as a long single note, you can use this to get notes that span phrase markers.

 

As always, workarounds like this should be used only when there is no reasonable way to have it look good within the rules.



#7 Nyxyxylyth

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 10:53 PM

You can also hide the lyric with "$".  I usually use both ("$+") out of paranoia.

 

Note that you'll need to avoid making the first phrase an overdrive phrase, because of the bug that causes overdrive to bleed into the next phrase when there's no gap between the phrases.

 

But keep HARM1 sane, and restrict the craziness to H2 and H3.



#8 Nolan

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 10:56 PM

swear I've seen the same thing with HARM1 notes (although I can't name any examples so maybe I'm crazy)

"Waiting for the End" by Linkin Park has it. https://youtu.be/Z68als2r0mY?t=2m50s


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#9 Frick

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Posted December 29, 2017 - 11:07 PM

As always, workarounds like this should be used only when there is no reasonable way to have it look good within the rules.

But keep HARM1 sane, and restrict the craziness to H2 and H3.

 

Yeah, this is just a weird case where HARM3 completely takes over the "lead" position for a verse and HARM1 ends up functioning as a backing vocalist. Not something I would normally try to do, but it's really necessary here.

 

Also,

 

"Waiting for the End" by Linkin Park has it. https://youtu.be/Z68als2r0mY?t=2m50s

 

I knew it!! I'd be curious to see how that was achieved. It's also interesting because that really doesn't look like a situation that would need it.



#10 i0brendan0

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Posted December 30, 2017 - 03:19 AM

I've seen a chart where they used a + to keep the same note across phrases. Also happens to be one I'm fixing up and I removed that by moving the phrase marker cause I thought it didn't look good.

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#11 Farottone

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Posted December 30, 2017 - 02:29 PM

I'm pretty sure you can't have slides spanning phrases, meaning you can't have a note with a syllable as the last note of a phrase and a note with a + as the first note of the next phrase. In short, for notes to span phrases in game they need to span them in the MIDI, not as a result of a slide.



#12 Nolan

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Posted December 30, 2017 - 09:13 PM

I knew it!! I'd be curious to see how that was achieved. It's also interesting because that really doesn't look like a situation that would need it.

Honestly, I think it was a mistake. I agree that it really wasn't a necessary situation for it to happen, and whoever charted it at Harmonix decided to avoid splitting phrases at 3:41 so that the blue line didn't pass through again, resulting in a very long phrase. I feel like if the first instance of the blue line passing through was done on purpose, they wouldn't have been opposed to splitting that one really long phrase up. Either way, it's a very interesting scenario; I've never seen the blue line pass through on any other official chart on RB3 (at least not on harmonies; some early charts sometimes have messed up phrase markers on solo vocals in RB3 which force parts of phrases to get cut off mid-note, but that's more of a glitch than anything really)


I primarily play drums and sometimes chart stuff





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